I am sure for description of some expansions that there will be wild animals to face but, will be other tribes? I’d really love to have some combats (or escapes) from other tribes (AI)
I think this could be a good place for dungeons and dragons-esq rules. Sneak attack bonuses. Silent kills. Things like that. Camouflage would be a nice touch.
I’d actually like to see (amongst other things) military technology and tactics improve over time. Go from a band of disorganised rabble with sharpened sticks, to full fledged bronze age armies, marching in formation.
The developers have expressed that the game will be much less about war and fighting, than about building a city (village). For example in their Spanish interview a few weeks ago. The subject of war and fighting has also been discussed before in different threads, for example in this one, dealing with the grand strategy of it all, and in this one, more about the tactics. I think there was a thread about hunting too… hmm… Anyway, please read them both, and write your thoughts there too, we always need more new perspectives!
Your mentioning Dungeons & Dragons, @stevenmilner85, really brought old memories back to life Maybe there is even room for a few quests in this game? The neighbouring village wants you to help them, or some old wanderer comes to your village, telling tales? It may be a city-builder, but there will surely be room for some role-playing elements, in time at least…
We plan external and internal enemies in the long run.
I would love some rpgmaker aspects. I always thought civil style building mixed with rpgmaker character development was a good mix.
[quote=“stevenmilner85, post:6, topic:2222”]
would love some rpgmaker aspects.[/quote]
Can you elaborate?
Things like skill development. Items that improve said skills. And details are a must. If my guys in his equipment bar is wearing a bone necklace and two copper rings. I want to see them on his body. Tools. The difference between high and low quality should not end with the title. It should be visible different. Shaman totems. Make them vast and detailed. If I raid aND kill a powerful Shaman. Get visceral with it. Give me the option to use his body or peice something of it on my staff. Perception provides power. What’s more frightening than seeing the head of someone you though invincible as a part of someone else’s totem or staff. Items provide stats. As well they did in real life. There is a reason when we see someone with big diamonds and nice suits they tend to be targets. Powerful men want to feel powerful 10000 years ago they did gruesome things. Look at the Aztec Empire. Allow for the building of alters to the gods. Taking notes from Conan Exiles is not a bad idea. Hunting bears should not only feed the people. I should see bear fur clothing and blankets. Bear claw and bone weapons. Higher level characters such as famous warriors should have interchangeable unique armor. They should not all wear the same armor. I strain that harshly. Don’t just change the color pattern of armor change the whole deal. Warriors of that time were gritty, powerful, and fighting men. Taking no lip from anyone. Fiercely loyal to the tribe. Make me fear them. Make me respect these men. Also rpg’s tend to have good combat animations. I would say take notes from some of the animations and mocap from Starwars the old republic. Then expand on it dramatically. Make me enjoy watching the battles. Especially if there isn’t suppost to be many of them. Cut scene kills. Both single, duel, and group kills. Being able to kill a merchant and take everything he had on him as well as what he was selling is a great mechanic from rpg games.
Also tattoos could be another. Give me some time and I may be able to work up a base character sheet you guys may be able to use as a reference.
While much of what your asking for are things I would be positive towards too… I do feel its a bit much of detail for a city-building game in which combat will be a small part. Though some of it sounds feasible even so. Our people will surely use hundreds of tools, from tiny to large ones, constantly breaking them and making new ones, of stone at the onset… but certain ones, especially weapons, might be special? An obsidian dagger that was taken from the great battle of the Golden Bend, when a band of Hakira from the other side of the mountain came down to steal our animals? They were defeated, and young Ugga-bugga truly proved his worth, killing three enemies and capturing the dagger. The heads of the enemies were all laid at the altar of Sharksh, the Wolf of the Night…
It’s a bit Dwarf Fortress
But yeah, the first version of the game will probably have very little of this But maybe an “RPG expansion” in the future, to give a lot more flavour and immersion…?
what would be great is gathering a war band and marching off with a war chief to raid pack animals, resources or even capture enemies and bring them back as loot…and for sacrificial purposes…This would make the actual palisade fence useful if not even necessary…
Please Try to remember that it’s not just about the city. It’s the people that interest most people. Building up not just buildings but heroes. Hercules and the like. Some are simply born to greatness. Some not so much, that’s what makes this whole concept of a game interesting. We have all seen buildings, what we haven’t seen is building of the tapestry of humanity. The world is a stage, and the people in it but actors. Some linger in a scene and affect very little. Some are there but a moment but leave an impression, an impact as to bring us to our knees. Then their part is over. Gone from the stage leaving us empty, begging for but a single whisper more.
We can’t hope to have A.C. being in the same time a great survival city builder, a great Total War and a great Skyrim – if only for a question of development time and processing power.
However, I think prestige should be allowed a great role in the game, to define the relations inside the tribe or with other tribes.
I’m thinking here of Brú na Bóinne that @Gal2 showed here, or the similar Gavrinis, Stonehenge, etc.
Clearly, they’ve not been build by a 10-member tribe used to be raided every summer by enemies, as we know the stones could come from hundreds of kilometers and needed a chief and an undefined number of workers which was clearly higher then 5 strong men.
Also, the neolithic is a period, after the older ones, that show long range trade, with shells, stones and peculiar objects being exchanged.
So, my best hope is that prestige may be gained all along the game, by various processes: exchanges (such things against this red stone), raids (being feared and respected by neighbor tribes is a great road to prestige), cultural achievements (“Have you seen the burial of our last chief?”), number of inhabitants and resources (like the necklaces being made with deer canines, or with fossil sea urchins), etc. That would be real great for RPG.
And to that I’d like to ask another point, that @stevenmilner85 should agree with: I really hope to see some deified characters, either great rulers, great warriors, great hunters or even an inventor being awarded the title of “fertility god(dess)”, with their dedicated shrines and a magnificient neolithic statue of them
I’m sure the developers will reach some form of compromise that will make us all somewhat happy and wanting for more While city-building, for better or worse, will be at the centre, certain RPG elements can be woven into that. For example, as @Elfryc is suggestion, several actions performed by the Player can have effects that would mimic that of a character in a RPG. Diplomacy and war can be quite RPG like Look at it like Baldur’s Gate with cities instead of characters^^
The developers have so far been against having the Player actually “living” in the game, but… I wonder what they would say towards a milder form of representation, such as one of the tribe members being the leader (and the Player therefore being the “voice” of this leader"), and that the way this leader performs and acts, would create a slight RPG element. In Children of the Nile, it was just so, and when this leader died, the Player’s decision on the burial would effect the prestige of the city (like @Elfryc suggested). The deification by the way, was probably quite common when organised polytheism developed, as we see in Gilgamesh and the Iliad, where very many characters are said to be “heroes” and “son of [a god]”, and acting divine some way or the other…
I’m skeptical about this point. A “light version” would be similar to El Presidente in Tropico, which actually had as a figure no real “power”. The presence was rather the question whether “El Presidente” could win the next election and issue decrees (against dollars). No bad principle, but quite thin. At least there was a parliament with resorts, whose effect was hardly noticeable. Kalypso even, which can only economy and money. On the other hand, anno, siedler, caesar, stronghold, and others without personified leaders, but in all it was finally about conquering another territory after the own base was built, or it was necessary to fulfill a certain task. The control was also based on the selection of the buildings, which in turn provided raw materials for further building construction, also population growth.
In view of the manageable team of developers, we should wait for the beta.
A valid point. The “Presidente” in the Tropico seemed to be mostly about comical relief. But remember: in Children of the Nile, the “ruler” could not be controlled, could not be sent to a certain place, or told to do something, like the “Presidente” character in Tropico. The ruler in Children of the Nile was, just like everyone else in the game, completely independent, and did whatever he wanted. To be honest, the only thing the player ever did with this ruler was… well… make sure he had a nice palace (for prestige) and a nice tomb (for prestige). And of course make sure that the palace always had access to shops selling nice luxury items and other things…
Yes, the game developers with rulers are not really clear. They must be, but for what purpose and why? “The king has said we should” … Of course “rule” is difficult to program, in the end it is politics. Ruling probably works only with a staff that passes the commands / requests. This staff, of course, is also a rival to the ruler, because he is closer to the ruled, whose mood can be recognized. A ruler must be able to rely on the integrity of his staff, but must never trust them 100%. On the other hand, he is free in the selection of his confidants. I think a mixture of jurisprudence (in quiz form), available privileges and different forms of violence could be an approach. For this the NPC’s would have to have a clever evaluation system for “content with the rule” - incl. Something like proportionally “public opinion”. Stronghold had the approach, but reduced to rich / tax / different buildings / churches. Consequence: People come or leave the city. Revolution was not foreseen. At AC, e.g. a dissatisfied part of the tribe could set off and found a new own village …
On the other hand, with a small group of neolite settlers, there are hardly any opportunities to “rule”. Think of something like a reinsurance. “What do you think if we do this and that? Huba, Buba, and I would be for it” …