World Map

[Marko]

Just a note that you can have some limited metalwork with native metals even before smelting is invented.

[lotus253]

True!

I have worked copper using ONLY neolithic tools. Cold forging is quite a pain, but would make simple pendants and basic tools.

[Grigor]

I completely agree with @Elfryc, allowing in game migrations across climate zones would not only be a pain for developers (unless it changes completely from one site to the other, or by a black-and-white border in the ground), but would also be unrealistic. Sure, after a long time our tribe would surely be able to migrate all the way from the French Atlantic coast, through Southern Europe and the Balkans, into Minor Asia, up the Zagros mountains and then down into Mesopotamia… but is it even remotely plausible that any one tribe made such a journey within a life time? In the Neolithicum? Many millennia later, during the Achaemenid Empire, when there was order from the Bosphorus to the Indus river, travelling from Mesopotamia was still viewed as something amazing, something normally only traders would do (by ship!) and imperial envoys.

For our tribesmen, it must also seem foolish to drag on, endlessly, away from more fertile and game-rich lands, constantly to the south and east. The nomadic tribes of the Neolithicum and before, never moved because they felt like it, but because they had to. They came to a new land, untouched by human hands, and lived there for as long as it was worthwhile, potentially for many years, depending on many factors. Scientists today believe it took tens of thousands of years for Man to get from East Africa to Europe. And if our tribesmen decided in 9000 BC to go back, south and east… they would be going against the flow, into areas more densely populated, with less game, and all the “good spots” taken.

I do agree to @Elfryc’s suggestion, that generally speaking, our tribe should be stuck in the general region where we first started. Sure, we can migrate within Atlantic Europe or Mesopotamia or similar… but not between one biome and another.

And yes, trade is much easier, and should be allowed even between regions quite early Even if a single merchant can’t bring amber from the Baltics to the Balkans… several can

[tschuschi]

Also think, 30 km is a generous distance. The march distance of troops is generally assumed between 22.5 and 45 kilometers. In the case of impassable terrain, obstacles caused by rivers and bad weather, 22.5 kilometers can be very ambitious. Added to this are deductions for unknown terrain.
I could imagine that you did not intentionally build too close to another settlement, unless you wanted to provoke or was allied in some form.
On the other hand, proximity to other strains would have the advantage of a gene mix that would have been beneficial to the immune system. Probably this did not happen consciously, but instinctively, about fragrance.
Exciting theme!

[tschuschi]

I have read something about “procedure generation”, some games use the apparently very long for different applications within the game. Usually it appears to be used in connection with the generation of the map usage.
Does AC work with such algorithms? (Please forbearance, layman )

[Grigor]

Procedural generation lets the computer generate things from, as far as I understand it, certain equations, that repeat in a random way. So though a few simple commands, like “Make a lake every few kilometres” and “Make a forest every few hundred meters”, a large map can be generated. Otherwise, one would have to actually make the entire map by hand, placing every forest, every lake… Of course, procedural generation doesn’t have to be used just for map generation, but practically anything, like the portraits of the thousands of characters in Crusader Kings II.

Of course, it’s more complicated than that, for what is a forest? How large? How many trees? The same with the lake, but also mountains, their height, and so forth. Not to mention how these meet, how far between them, steep cliffs or gentle slopes… In a sense, life itself is build on this: the contents of a single cell core contains the designs of an entire organism, millions of times large than the cell core. A handful of laws of science explains our entire universe, from galaxies to atoms (bot not smaller than that… ).

The problem is making the randomness not just feel… bland. In Banished, every map practically looked the same, with perfect circular lakes, and strange rivers that could go parallels with each other, and other oddities. The procedural generation wasn’t that good. However, to make it better, you need to add more information, more exceptions, more rules, more commands… and that takes a lot of work, and a lot of space. Mathematics helps, check out the Wikipedia article on fractals for example.

[lotus253]

This is something I used to code for science models.
Rules are required or your models will fail (boundary conditions).

One technique is an evolutionary model. Simplified:

1. Create land with random height mean a sigma deviation boundary (maybe 1 o 2 sig)

2. Create water with mean and div

3. Allow water to change surrounding land depth based on a cumulative proximity/density (more water creates greater depth).

4. Apply plants based on water proximity, soil type, altitude, etc

5. Apply rocks based on altitude/water (rocks are exposed in this way).

6. Apply animals, etc

It can be fun to make these simulations! \o/

[tschuschi]

這不是我的施工現場，但聽起來很令人興奮。

[xshinel]

你为什么会说中文？

[tschuschi]

@xshinel

你为什么会说中文？

Technical jargon, not my world

[Gal2]

Hi all! I revive this topic to show my hypotheses regarding the new world map screenshot that has been revealed. I would love to hear your interpretations! For those who haven’t seen the screenshot at issue, here it is:

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And here are my guesses:

[Grigor]

Hopefully, what we are seeing is in reference to what we would actually be building on the city map. If our village becomes bigger, so should the symbolic representation on the world map change. If we build a wall around it, it should have one. If we build a great temple, that should be visible on the world map. Maybe there might even be some simple mechanics for building on a hill or mountain, by the sea, or by a river?

Of course, tribes, cultures, peoples, nations, clans, and the likes, should somehow be represented, so that one can see on the world map who is kith and kin, and who is a strange alien. And if there is a chieftain or some other leader for our tribe, our several villages, his place should be visible too, as a capital.

[tschuschi]

First, see what and how deep the player can influence … Maybe 5 villages are already too much? Guess it will not be CIV, more like Cultures. Damn it! we must allude it.

[Okan6426]

Imagine how cool it would be if you had some time to adapt to the region for your people to change morphology: the longer you stay in europe the more caucasian you become and same goes for asia, africa and such. Also we could have a migration map recalculation after come point like maybe every 1000 years(just to give it a number) it’s recalculating the migration map based on your position.